Mathias Payer (@gannimo@infosec.exchange)
infosec.exchangeAttached: 1 image
As it turns out, Volkswagen has been collecting extensive geo data from all their electric cars and made them available online in an AWS bucket. Almost 10TB of geo traces from 15 MiO cars. Amazing detail and patterns. This is why I don't want a smart car 🤯 https://events.ccc.de/congress/2024/hub/en/event/wir-wissen-wo-dein-auto-steht-volksdaten-von-volkswagen/ #Volksdaten
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I don’t get why they feel the need to keep it a secret.
Google takes GeoLocation data with maps and people happily use it. I even put reviews for places I go to.
If they were to just be above board about it while selling the stuff, they would have much happier customers and they could even get some legitimate use out of the data, like traffic status that Google does.
I’m not a fan of Google, but must say, they definitely managed to do better in this regard.
Obviously… It’s anti-libre software. It fails to include a libre software license text file, like GPL. We do not control it.
I would love to know how to disable telemetry on my own hard drive on wheels or at worst prevent it from phoning home. Mozilla did a great job bringing this issue to light but now we need actionable solutions that don’t rely on governments passing laws
Accidentally, lol. The point was to mine and sell the data, wasn’t it? Not exactly private.
The made public part is the accidental
Spain is mostly empty
Anyone that has owned a recent VW, knew this was true. I would get text messages from my local dealer anytime I was close to needing an oil change.
That’s so weird! Just like when my dentist calls me to an appointment when I’ve had a cavity for six years! Incredible! Just when I need to fill it!
Wouldn’t that just be a time based notification rather then dependent on any privacy invading metrics?
Not from my experience. I went from driving the car like 30000 miles a year to like 5000, the text messages were always about right on time for my services based on miles driven. Clearly the car was reporting to VW in some way routinely.
"I told a joke to my wife. I laughed, my wife laughed, my smart toster laughed "
Somewhat relevant XKCD
Shame on VW, but if you have a mobile phone…
After dieselgate and the discovery that VW was subjecting monkeys and humans to exhaust fumes in experimentation, their sales are still fine.
I honestly don’t think consumers give a shit about what negative things companies do.
Certainly many people do, though. It depends on the individual.
It’s when they become loud mouth attention seekers like Musk that people begin to care. But if everyone claiming to boycott Musk products actually boycotted all the companies that have done terrible things (and way worse than musk), they’d suddenly have nothing to buy.
My boycott is not meaningful because I can’t really finance such an expensive car anyway.
I think they just don’t know. People are oversaturated and oversaturated and overloaded, and suffering for scraps, nobody has time, mental space or money to be choosy. Researching companies, suspiciously doesn’t show results. Finding that information isn’t easy, by design. It might be released, on the same day something else happens. But mostly people aren’t watching the news to the depth required to soak that stuff in, and don’t have the extra energy to soak anything in. Everything sent into our hands and eyes as news is controlled by a few with vested inrests. It would be lovely if there was a place that collected atrocities and kept them fresh. Who stopped buying nestle after all the horrible things they’ve done. I can bet you have supported a company with your dollar, that’s responsible for huge atrocities, it’s almost impossible to avoid. Look at the stuff happening in the Congo atm, all the top brands, committing atrocities for new phones to be built. How much have we heard about all of that? There’s so much. Where do you start. Funny story, I watched resident evil with my kid, just recently, and it was terrifying for whole new reasons. A top company who owns everything, goes into weapon manufacturing and creating advanced bio weapons, accidentally releases it, then doubles down continuously, shutting thousands in to die, and firing into crouds to cover up what it did. And that doesn’t seem far fetched, any more. All for the ever expansion of money, something that has a finite amount set. Literally the only way to achieve ever expansion is to commit atrocities, there’s a point where you take too much and the only option is atrocities to make more. And that’s capitalism, baby!!
That’s why there will be many more Luigi’s before anything improves.
Thank you. There is so much shit going on, keeping up to date with everything is literally unhealthy.
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Is it identifiable? Can it be attributed to individual car level?
I don’t imagine it would be difficult to figure out, especially if you know someone’s address.
Looking at the map, assuming these models aren’t for sale in Poland, Czech and so forth?
Maybe Skoda wasn’t part of it, that’s the most sold brand in Czechia and Slovakia
“Accidentally” is the new “through incompetence”
Negligence. Volkwagen can afford competence, but chose not to invest in it.
Is there a company yet that let’s me pay them to internet disconnect and rip out sensors on a modern car?
Dacia doesn’t have that crap. They only have the mandatory SOS system.
BTW, if someone has a way to rip that system out, please share
Do they make an electric car that doesn’t have such sensors (eg cabin microphone) and doesn’t have internet access?
My 2nd Generation Nissan Leaf is primitive, I do not use half the crap in the car, compared to the competition.
They do, the Dacia Spring has nothing like that if I’m not wrong
Edit: just checked, and it seems they added all the connected big screens crap, my bad
I don’t know about electric but the regular ones are available in basic versions without internet and “luxury” ones with all that crap
GDPR/DORA monies when?