Things that make me angry about my current smartphone Samsung Galaxy S21Ultra on a Verizon plan is the mandatory software updates in which they install WITHOUT MY PERMISSION stupid apps like Netflix and addictive gambling games and stacking block games and Candy crush. God knows what else they install without my permission. I don’t want any of it!
Next phone I buy I want to start with a clean slate, I’m not going to affiliate with any conglomerate like Verizon or AT&T or Sprint or T-Mobile etc, I prefer to go rogue somehow,
which smartphone do you recommend that has no bloatware and it’s customizable?
A place to discuss privacy and freedom in the digital world.
Privacy has become a very important issue in modern society, with companies and governments constantly abusing their power, more and more people are waking up to the importance of digital privacy.
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Google Pixel with GrapheneOS.
I keep seeing this idea everywhere. Buy a Google phone and install another OS.
It is completely absurd to fund the exact adversaries you are running away from, while consuming, without contributing a dime, merely a piece of free software. (It is only a small piece of freedom because none of the hardware is free, and some binary blobs [incl. potential backdoors] will still be present in the alternative OS no matter which one it is.)
This is unsustainable, terrible, damaging advice. Stop giving it.
The bottom line is that GrapheneOS is the most security-focused mobile operating system available, and the Google Pixel is pretty well the only mainstream phone with an unlockable bootloader.
If Alphabet were to ever lock down the Pixel’s bootloader, the GOS devs would undoubtedly jump ship to a lesser available platform in order to continue the project. But until then, no other hardware comes close with respect to embedded security.
Buy a pixel off marketplace then. You can brag about saving e-waste.
Google isn’t a bad company, just a product of poor regulation. They have amazing engineers and produce valuable hardware and that should be praised.
Its the business side of things which needs massive regulation and an ethics check.
It is not about “bragging” or whatever. Nor is it about “bad” or “good”.
By funding or promoting the use of Google products, you would be funding litigation and influence such as lobbying to keep poor regulation as it is, if not worse. You would be funding their acquisitions of great tech and startups that might offer a more ethical and/or free technology. You would be funding their poaching of said engineers and valuable hardware intellectual property.
Simply put, it is a counterproductive and an unsustainable practice.
That being said, their amazing engineers, and technical value of their hardware are irrelevant to this community, post and comment. That simply doesn’t excuse their entire business model being built on breaches of privacy and other forms of curbing user freedoms.
Well, the only viable alternative then seems to be some sort of Linux phone, then.
Fairphone, Librem, PinePhone, f(x)tec, etc. are available alternatives, yes.
Even a OnePlus is better than directly funding and supporting the adversary organisation that is one of the biggest surveillance capitalism corporations on earth.
Fair point, I suppose the only thing preventing me from going for Linux phone are banking apps which want to run on unrooted android. 🤷🏼♂️
@unexpectedteapot @mihor
“Even a one plus” - ?
Im going to do this and leave every social media except some federated instances.
Already went with Linux and FOSS years ago. Finally time to say good riddance to everything that doesnt align for what I stand for. I like it better anyway
Just a tip, you can debloat your galaxy without rooting it with adb tools. You can remove any apps you want this way fairly easily.
Not a long term solution, and all the other comments are great options for replacement. Until then, you can remove almost anything you want until you’re ready to switch.
The none root method that you mentioned is just removing the application from your profile. It’s still present in the OS.
I don’t think that’s true. From XDA forums, you can choose to disable the app or completely remove it. I have completely destroyed the system from uninstalling critical apps. I have had to do a complete factory reset due to uninstalling core apps. No root whatsoever.
I’ve read it a few times over the years. Maybe I keep reading people say the same misinformation. I suppose without root we’ll never know.
Your anecdotal evidence could just be that you’ve ruined your profile; although of course, you could be entirely correct.
I’ve only used it to remove annoying apps, e.g. Facebook. I’ve never gone crazy with it as I don’t care about the manufacturer’s pre-installed apps as they’ve remained silent for me.
Pixel with GrapheneOS. Only one that will give you the complete control, as well as the privacy (and) security done right. Also the only one that will let you have a fully functional phone, have things like working bank apps, and let you beat the Goog out of the benefits of the play services, while at the same time not allowing them to have privileged access on your phone. They’re just normal apps that you are in control of.
Yes, you will. Because that’s who has the mobile networks. There is no such thing as going rogue. Going with an MVNO isn’t avoiding them, that’s a mind game. If you can save money going with one cool, but don’t kid yourself that you’re not on one of the 3 carriers, because you will be.
I’m just trying to avoid getting bloatware installed on my phone every time they run a mandatory software update. that was probably a Samsung thing and had nothing to do with Verizon but whatever the case,
It’s time to upgrade.
I’mma get starlink.
I have never heard of phone updates installing bloatware. The only time bloatware is present is when you first use the phone
Yup, I’m telling you, when I first got this phone, first thing I noticed was fucking candy crush et al, and immediately uninstalled all that junk. And every time it runs a software update, i kid you not, within a couple days I’m looking through my phone and I notice more shit they installed. Monopoly, Candy crush, block stacking games, I didn’t ask for any of this! delete delete delete.
As cool as the technology is, I wouldn’t trust Starlink to handle my breakfast order. It’s leadership is corrupt, arrogant, and evil. You can find all sorts of news stories about it online.
Another vote for fairphone here, but for reasons others failed to mention: replaceable battery, so even after 2 years, it can feel like new and keep most of its value (to resell if wanted); 5 years of updates + warranty; support for after market roms. Then there’s also the fair ethics part of it
How are you killing your battery after two years?
Even my cheapshit Honor 9 lasted six before it started getting random shutoffs.
Not killing, but degrades in performance because batteries have a limited amount of charge cycles. The more intensive you use your phone, the faster the battery degrades
old phones have batteries that are meant to last
For best privacy AND security, Pixel 8 or 8 Pro with GrapheneOS. Nothing else compares. The Pixel 8 series are also the first that support hardware memory tagging, basically making them immune against 70% of all exploits.
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Perhaps Fairphone?
Those are plagued with security issues.
I’m interested in reading about those. Dou you have a link or a list of some of those issues?
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Google Pixel or Nothing phone
Sure, the Nothing phone is a decent phone but it doesn’t really have anything to offer as far as privacy and security are concerned. On the contrary, I wouldn’t trust Nothing since their iMessage fiasco.
Yeah the whole iMessage thing wasn’t really what I cared about, given that it’s not a great look for them.
More so all the ex-oneplus talent that they have on staff to make a good quality product.
I’ve never heard of this company before the past week, and I’m seeing it everywhere now. I’m also really annoyed with this trend of companies appropriating random fucking words instead of using actual names.
Lots of good advice here, but many might be too extreme. I find such all-or-nothing approach intimidating for people who just started to think about improving their privacy situation.
Let’s see… you are angry about bloatware. It can come from two sources - mobile service carrier and phone manufacturer. How to get rid of it?
Now, we are in a privacy focused community and I saw your later comments about Google being an opposite of privacy. I would argue that vanilla Pixel is much better than bloated and locked Samsung already. I see you get recommendations to replace the OS that your new phone might run, and these are valid, but come with significant downsides. There are other ways to improve your privacy stance by changing the way how you use your phone without changing what phone or what OS you run on it.
Warning about bringing an unlocked phone to Verizon (even if it’s a current flagship Apple/Samsung/Google device): 50/50 they’ll lock you out of WiFi calling/HD voice, etc. Because they’re dicks.
Google Pixel. I dont know I want to keep my 4a actually as its small, nice and has a headphone jack.
The 4a is end of life and shouldn’t be used anymore.
I know the mantra
“smartphone” doesn’t matter. it is a computer that runs software. the only question is who controls that software? free/libre software is by definition one that you control. and what you described means that you dont control your device.
so advices: easy way is to just install lineage os or graphene or some other open source android version. you will control it. i dont advice to install google play services.
other advice: you can get a sony phone because it can run sailfish os. also i believe those are great. otherwise install open source android, lineage or something.
sailfish has android emulator (it costs money) but sailfish is not android. it is a linux/qt based system. very polished. not as polished as open source android, but it is fast, lightweight and beautiful. native sailfish apps arent feature rich but do you really need feature rich? then you can get more apps from fdroid store and use android emulation layer.
other, better but harder option: get a device which is well supported by postmarketos.
postmarketos has several user interfaces but neither of those is what you have used to. i believe it is the best option but you must prepare yourself to be able to change. most probably you wont have a working camera. thats ok, i live like that.
Gigaset. I am using the GS5. 2 Sim slots and a SD card slot, not those Sim/SD slots that most manufacturers use. Replaceable battery.
made is Germany, run stock android. Stock to the point of I have it bugging me to install Oct 2023 patches for the past 2 weeks. Kinka wish I could talk it I will patch when I get back from holidays.
Pixel w/GrapheneOS. Insane to do anything else when Privacy and Security is something you want, while also having the ability to have a fully functional phone.
A Pixel with GrapheneOS is okay but you don’t get Android Auto, which kinda sucks.
ooh no problem I despise android auto and glad it doesn’t force my phone to connect every time I start driving the way it did at the beginning, I had to dig into the settings and figure out how to disable it.
Well you won’t be able to use it at all even if you need it, but if that works for you, go nuts.
I can’t imagine ever needing it. What is it even for? All it ever did for me was instantly answer spam phone calls that I would have rejected, doesn’t let me use my phone until my GPS indicates I’ve reached my destination, and it would automatically answer texts telling them that I’m driving. Like leave me alone big brother ugh!
What are you going to use if you are driving somewhere new and don’t know where you are going though? I used AA for the maps and directions only and I miss it alot.
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Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
Don’t connect your phone to your car
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
I pair my phone to my car’s Bluetooth. Google maps is what I use. You don’t need Android Auto for that.
I use a phone holder and my phone sits there with my maps app showing me the navigation.
Same. I pair my phone to my car’s Bluetooth.
No Android Auto overbearing Big Brother necessary.
Seems that guy who loves Android Auto so much thinks there’s no other option 🤦♀️
Hey, you’re the one that bought a Samsung phone 🤹
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A Google Pixel running GrapheneOS is your best option. Graphene doesn’t have any Google services by default, no bloatware at all, maximum privacy and security. It’s super easy to install, you can check out this video guide or just read their official documentation.
Another video about GrapheneOS that I totally recommend: https://youtube.com/watch?v=yTeAFoQnQPo
I recommend this after the install: https://youtube.com/watch?v=BymH90zFe30
How well does apps that require locked bootloaders, non-rooted device etc. work on grapheneOS? We have an official 2FA app in my country that’s used for digital identification for everything from banking to social security services. Right now it isn’t working on my oneplus 9p with lineage, despite using magisk and passing safetynet check, because it still detects that my phone is rooted.
GrapheneOS is built to work with a locked bootloader, in fact, relocking the bootloader is a step in the installation guide. It’s not rooted by default and the GOS team highly recommends against rooting, all apps should work as long as they only require SafetyNet basic integrity. If they require full integrity, they won’t work on GrapheneOS because the OS has to be manually whitelisted by Google in order to pass the full integrity check. Most apps (including banking or government apps) only mandate basic integrity though, full integrity is rarely required. It should definitely work better than LineageOS.
Hmm, my lineage OS phone passes basic integrity check, and my banking apps all work as intended, as do other government apps. But this damn 2FA app is still complaining and refuses to work, saying the phone is insecure.
Yeah, that’s because your phone is rooted. By default you can’t get root on GrapheneOS so it should work there.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
this video guide
https://piped.video/watch?v=yTeAFoQnQPo
https://piped.video/watch?v=BymH90zFe30
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
Do be careful, your choices are very limited. All the carriers in the US, except TMobile today, have a whitelist of devices. Even if you make your own phone or buy an awesome phone from out of market, it won’t work.
Technically, there is no reason it won’t work. But the carriers block it from registering on the network unless roaming. Our non-American devices have been kicked off every network now except TMobile.
So your choice is really just the small list of devices they choose to support and 75% are the same phone. Samsung whatever with some various sized screen and various sized storage. Or Apple iWhatever.
They make your life hell with a non-standard carrier phone. And yes I’ve been buying out of region phones for 20 years now, even back with Windows Mobile and Palm devices with 2G text based web. Every year it gets harder and harder.
Im using my imported Zenfone 9 on AT&T without (much) issue. I did have to change some settings using ADB/terminal as root to enable volte so i can make calls since the phone doesn’t support all the bands used.