Which is fine and all, but they need to make it seem less sketchy.
There have been handheld gaming devices scams that have had events before, using either the one working prototype, or someone else’s device with a difference housing.
Manjaro is the distro I’ve used for the longest (like 7 years) and it was mostly fine, until I started using AUR, which you shouldn’t if you use Manjaro because it will cause problems. Holding packages for 2 weeks also cause problems (hence the AUR issue), it doesn’t make it stable. However, if you don’t use AUR, it should be fine. Though just FYI, if you want Arch-based there are better distros out there. If you’re happy with it, there is no need to change.
I have 77 AUR packages installed as we speak. There are no issues with AUR and Manjaro’s delayed packages. AUR are source packages. They will compile against whatever is installed.
Occasionally an installed AUR package breaks because I don’t update them automatically and the system libs have moved too far away from the binary I compiled. I rebuild it and that’s it.
Obviously, you shouldn’t install anything from AUR that will take the system down with it. This is true for any Arch distro.
In theory an AUR package can require an Arch package version that’s not in Manjaro yet. I’ve never had that happen in 4 years and dozens of AUR packages. If it ever did I’d either install an older version of the AUR package or get a flatpak version.
Don’t remember what packages caused problems for me but I had to repair it via tty quite a time. Not updating AUR packages automatically is actually a nice workaround to prevent system breakage which I was also doing it, until it started to cause problems more often. Maybe they fixed it I don’t know (though highly doubt it because of the way they do it), haven’t used Manjaro for 4 years. Then I thought about that, why would I need to deal with these kind of things if I can use my system up-to-date with every part of it. No one uses Manjaro because it’s stable, people use it because it was the only “Arch with GUI” they know at the time. Now we have a lot of these and some of them are better than Manjaro. But again, if you’re happy with Manjaro there is no need to change. I was happy until I wasn’t because of Manjaro’s structural problems (like they nuked AUR once). It’s not a bad thing to recommend a better option if you know one.
I’ve started using Manjaro 4 years ago so basically I picked up where you left.
The situation seems to have reversed, nowadays there are plenty of “arch installers” like you said but Manjaro is actually a “stable Arch” alternative… provided you actually want that and don’t do anything to rock the boat. Using flatpak instead of AUR when possible can help further.
I guess the key point there, using Manjaro as Manjaro, not as Arch. It can be stable that way since they also have their own repos. And I agree that using flatpaks instead of AUR on Manjaro would be better. Though at this point, if I am to switch distros, I would go for Void I guess. It’s actually nice to hear that Manjaro seems more stable now.
I have two go-to choices for Arch-based. EndeavourOS is basically what everyone want and expect from Manjaro, Arch with a GUI installer, no bloat, easy to use. You can even install Pamac and use it if that’s convenient for you. Artix comes systemd-free, you can install OpenRC, runit etc. It’s faster for my old laptop.
There is also Archcraft. It might look like a student project (maybe it is), but it’s an easy way to use Arch if you’re comfortable with their design choices. This one also has really nice small scripts here and there.
@muhyb I use EndeavourOS myself, but I was wondering if there’s an Arch based distro that is a bit more stable and that I can recommend to people but still allows for using AUR without much trouble.
The vast majority of Arch derivates are still Arch with some candy on top. Endeavour for example is just an installer, a default package selection, a handful of non-essential packages of their own and some desktop eye-candy – in other words the absolute minimum so it can be called a distinct distro. But it’s very much Arch inside.
Manjaro uses Arch as an upstream distro but modifies packages extensively, uses its graphical installer to actually autodetect and install everything a machine might need by default, has designed an user-friendly package manager interface on top of pamac, adds a driver manager with autodetect, a kernel manager and so on.
Unfortunately this puts Manjaro on the hatelist for two groups: a section of the Arch community who hate anything that makes Arch less hardcore, and Linux newbs that get tricked by Manjaro’s self-claim of “user friendly” and end up bricking their system then go around telling everybody how much it sucks and how “it just broke”.
Ironically, if you leave Manjaro the fuck alone and don’t do dumb stuff like use a non-LTS kernel or switch to the non-stable branches or install critical system components from AUR etc. it tends to be super-stable. Unfortunately it tends to attract users for all the wrong reasons.
To answer your question, to recommend it to people it depends a lot on the type of people. I’m an experienced Linux user, I know what stuff to not do and what to not install from AUR etc. At the other extreme I have completely Linux-clueless family members using Manjaro perfectly fine because they don’t have sudo rights and they can’t fuck it up. But there’s a type of Linux user that falls in between that’s going to mess around and screw up and then blame the distro for things that if they did on Arch they’d get told to GTFO – and I think those people should not use Manjaro or any Arch distro because they’re dumb and hateful and Arch-based stuff requires a bit of brain and a willingness to learn.
I’m quite happy with EndeavourOS and last time I had a problem, it was a GRUB problem and they changed to systemd-boot by default after that. Other than this, never had problems since. To be honest, I stopped recommending Arch-based to people unless they’re somewhat experienced, otherwise I recommend Linux Mint. However, EndeavourOS is what I recommend if someone wants a GUI installer for Arch and I don’t think there is a better option yet.
let people use what they want. If they want to use Manjarno and reset their clocks because of expired certificates every other year, so be it. But don’t be elitist about it. Same goes for the usage of the puke emoji.
IDK, what does “Pi” have to do with anything? Orange Pi is a Raspberry Pi-like device running an ARM SOC and their Orange Pi 800 also uses an ARM SOC.
The Orange Pi Neo doesn’t have an ARM chip, isn’t at all related to the Raspberry Pi, and isn’t Orange. It’s like their trying to mix the branding of Raspberry Pi and Ayaneo, without understanding what makes either cool.
Yeah, it looks nice. But they could probably get Valve to maintain their hardware in SteamOS if they approach them. But maybe Bazzite is also low effort, IDK.
I used Manjaro for about a year around 2019 and it was awful.
I liked its selling point on being based on Arch and having access to AUR, but the official repositories would only have stuff that is vetted to work on the current release of Manjaro (at least that’s what I had heard about Manjaro at the time)
The amount of times a package update shit the floor is too many to count.
Before that I was using Ubuntu and for the most part it was fine.
The first distro I used was Mint since the desktop environments, Cinnamon, resembled Windows XP.
Read through the link i provided. The major point i take issue with, is their package repository. They basically delay every package for a few days to call them ‘stable’. This behavior makes it by definition incompatible with the AUR. One of the major reasons so many Manjaro systems break. The other reason is their awful package manager.
I ran my manjaro install for over 3 years but never touched pamac and instead used pacman and paru. I was simply too lazy to set up another distro at the time.
The last line completely detered me
7840U is a beast. That’s what Framework puts in their high-end AMD laptop.
This seems like a scam.
The website is image-only.
Not having any selectable text is super sketchy.
It uses “Orange Pi” but isn’t running on an Orange Pi.
If you go to the real manjaro website: https://manjaro.org/ and search for “neo”, this doesn’t come up:
https://manjaro.org/search/?query=neo
…or orange pi
https://manjaro.org/search/?query=orange+pi
Edit: People are saying that is it real. If it is, they really need to make it seem less sketchy.
They literally had an event lol.
That event was just a Gif.
Which is fine and all, but they need to make it seem less sketchy.
There have been handheld gaming devices scams that have had events before, using either the one working prototype, or someone else’s device with a difference housing.
It’s real
https://twitter.com/ManjaroLinux/status/1753764589605437902
https://videocardz.com/newz/orange-pi-neo-gaming-handheld-detailed-features-amd-ryzen-7-7840u-apu-and-manjaro-os
If it is real, then need to make it seem less sketchy.
Tbh that photo looks photoshopped.
So they called it an “Orange Pi”, but it is not an ARM SBC.
That’s an interesting choice.
Is that a collab I wonder… Logo looks similar
They have a platform at least? Some day they may release one. The main problem with arm gaming is that you could also do it on a phone+controllers.
Manjarno isn’t even a good choice for desktops though
My desktop machine would like to disagree.
Manjaro is the distro I’ve used for the longest (like 7 years) and it was mostly fine, until I started using AUR, which you shouldn’t if you use Manjaro because it will cause problems. Holding packages for 2 weeks also cause problems (hence the AUR issue), it doesn’t make it stable. However, if you don’t use AUR, it should be fine. Though just FYI, if you want Arch-based there are better distros out there. If you’re happy with it, there is no need to change.
I have 77 AUR packages installed as we speak. There are no issues with AUR and Manjaro’s delayed packages. AUR are source packages. They will compile against whatever is installed.
Occasionally an installed AUR package breaks because I don’t update them automatically and the system libs have moved too far away from the binary I compiled. I rebuild it and that’s it.
Obviously, you shouldn’t install anything from AUR that will take the system down with it. This is true for any Arch distro.
In theory an AUR package can require an Arch package version that’s not in Manjaro yet. I’ve never had that happen in 4 years and dozens of AUR packages. If it ever did I’d either install an older version of the AUR package or get a flatpak version.
Don’t remember what packages caused problems for me but I had to repair it via tty quite a time. Not updating AUR packages automatically is actually a nice workaround to prevent system breakage which I was also doing it, until it started to cause problems more often. Maybe they fixed it I don’t know (though highly doubt it because of the way they do it), haven’t used Manjaro for 4 years. Then I thought about that, why would I need to deal with these kind of things if I can use my system up-to-date with every part of it. No one uses Manjaro because it’s stable, people use it because it was the only “Arch with GUI” they know at the time. Now we have a lot of these and some of them are better than Manjaro. But again, if you’re happy with Manjaro there is no need to change. I was happy until I wasn’t because of Manjaro’s structural problems (like they nuked AUR once). It’s not a bad thing to recommend a better option if you know one.
I’ve started using Manjaro 4 years ago so basically I picked up where you left.
The situation seems to have reversed, nowadays there are plenty of “arch installers” like you said but Manjaro is actually a “stable Arch” alternative… provided you actually want that and don’t do anything to rock the boat. Using flatpak instead of AUR when possible can help further.
I guess the key point there, using Manjaro as Manjaro, not as Arch. It can be stable that way since they also have their own repos. And I agree that using flatpaks instead of AUR on Manjaro would be better. Though at this point, if I am to switch distros, I would go for Void I guess. It’s actually nice to hear that Manjaro seems more stable now.
@muhyb What arch based distros would you recommend?
I have two go-to choices for Arch-based. EndeavourOS is basically what everyone want and expect from Manjaro, Arch with a GUI installer, no bloat, easy to use. You can even install Pamac and use it if that’s convenient for you. Artix comes systemd-free, you can install OpenRC, runit etc. It’s faster for my old laptop.
There is also Archcraft. It might look like a student project (maybe it is), but it’s an easy way to use Arch if you’re comfortable with their design choices. This one also has really nice small scripts here and there.
@muhyb I use EndeavourOS myself, but I was wondering if there’s an Arch based distro that is a bit more stable and that I can recommend to people but still allows for using AUR without much trouble.
The vast majority of Arch derivates are still Arch with some candy on top. Endeavour for example is just an installer, a default package selection, a handful of non-essential packages of their own and some desktop eye-candy – in other words the absolute minimum so it can be called a distinct distro. But it’s very much Arch inside.
Manjaro uses Arch as an upstream distro but modifies packages extensively, uses its graphical installer to actually autodetect and install everything a machine might need by default, has designed an user-friendly package manager interface on top of pamac, adds a driver manager with autodetect, a kernel manager and so on.
Unfortunately this puts Manjaro on the hatelist for two groups: a section of the Arch community who hate anything that makes Arch less hardcore, and Linux newbs that get tricked by Manjaro’s self-claim of “user friendly” and end up bricking their system then go around telling everybody how much it sucks and how “it just broke”.
Ironically, if you leave Manjaro the fuck alone and don’t do dumb stuff like use a non-LTS kernel or switch to the non-stable branches or install critical system components from AUR etc. it tends to be super-stable. Unfortunately it tends to attract users for all the wrong reasons.
To answer your question, to recommend it to people it depends a lot on the type of people. I’m an experienced Linux user, I know what stuff to not do and what to not install from AUR etc. At the other extreme I have completely Linux-clueless family members using Manjaro perfectly fine because they don’t have sudo rights and they can’t fuck it up. But there’s a type of Linux user that falls in between that’s going to mess around and screw up and then blame the distro for things that if they did on Arch they’d get told to GTFO – and I think those people should not use Manjaro or any Arch distro because they’re dumb and hateful and Arch-based stuff requires a bit of brain and a willingness to learn.
I’m quite happy with EndeavourOS and last time I had a problem, it was a GRUB problem and they changed to systemd-boot by default after that. Other than this, never had problems since. To be honest, I stopped recommending Arch-based to people unless they’re somewhat experienced, otherwise I recommend Linux Mint. However, EndeavourOS is what I recommend if someone wants a GUI installer for Arch and I don’t think there is a better option yet.
Manjaro 🤮
Puke emoji 🤮
elitism 🤢
@Helix what do you mean?
let people use what they want. If they want to use Manjarno and reset their clocks because of expired certificates every other year, so be it. But don’t be elitist about it. Same goes for the usage of the puke emoji.
Cool, the more Linux-based handhelds, the better! I would prefer a handheld with RK3588S, but this one is interesting too.
The AMD apu is far superior but also far more expensive. Their gpu is just unbeatable. Also software support is guaranteed on x86.
Sure, but I usually run emulators and open source ports, so with an ARM I would have more battery life.
No you wouldn’t. The Rockchips are far less efficient than AMD’s modern X86 stuff.
AMD’s new stuff is on par with the M1 in efficiency.
Even despite they require active cooling? Didn’t know, cool! Now the only downside is size.
I don’t know if he’s correct on low power use cases, but the cooling is way more about the high power use cases.
The steam deck can chew through it’s battery in ~2 hours or last something in the neighborhood of 8-10 depending what you run on it.
Available in only black and white colors.
Unusable and not fit for purpose. There needs to be an orange color as an option in order for this product to make any sense whatsoever.
IDK, what does “Pi” have to do with anything? Orange Pi is a Raspberry Pi-like device running an ARM SOC and their Orange Pi 800 also uses an ARM SOC.
The Orange Pi Neo doesn’t have an ARM chip, isn’t at all related to the Raspberry Pi, and isn’t Orange. It’s like their trying to mix the branding of Raspberry Pi and Ayaneo, without understanding what makes either cool.
Terrible branding because I at first thought it was an underpowered system that would only be good for retro gaming.
How dare they use their brand name! Spectrum types will have a conniption fit. Prepare for apoplexy!
Orange Pi is a brand that has some recognition as a Raspberry Pi knockoff. Presumably it’s the same people leveraging that existing brand.
why a desktop distro like Manjaro and not something like Bazzite that’s actually made for gaming handhelds?
Or just HoloOS. Steam Deck has proven the design, why overcomplicate things?
Bazzite seems to perform better overall
Yeah, it looks nice. But they could probably get Valve to maintain their hardware in SteamOS if they approach them. But maybe Bazzite is also low effort, IDK.
Well it’s a Manjaro project… it would be pretty weird if they used another Linux distro for their own project.
FWIW I’m guessing it’s going to be heavily customized and not bear a great resemblance to desktop Manjaro, like SteamOS doesn’t resemble regular Arch.
Just put bazzite on it, that would be my first step
Ah here we fucking go again.
Guess I was wrong, when I surmised in the other thread that it’s just a Manjaro image.
Wow!
The great thing about manjaro is, that when it finally bricks itself you can install a proper distro on it. https://github.com/arindas/manjarno
I used Manjaro for about a year around 2019 and it was awful.
I liked its selling point on being based on Arch and having access to AUR, but the official repositories would only have stuff that is vetted to work on the current release of Manjaro (at least that’s what I had heard about Manjaro at the time)
The amount of times a package update shit the floor is too many to count.
Before that I was using Ubuntu and for the most part it was fine.
The first distro I used was Mint since the desktop environments, Cinnamon, resembled Windows XP.
Read through the link i provided. The major point i take issue with, is their package repository. They basically delay every package for a few days to call them ‘stable’. This behavior makes it by definition incompatible with the AUR. One of the major reasons so many Manjaro systems break. The other reason is their awful package manager.
I ran my manjaro install for over 3 years but never touched pamac and instead used pacman and paru. I was simply too lazy to set up another distro at the time.
Even better is you don’t even need to wait those three days. You can replace it straight away! :-)
Three is pretty charitable, I usually run updates on the first day…